Monday 4 February 2019

Auto Driver

(Yesterday there was a discussion on my wall on auto drives, auto rates. On what is reasonable.
This discussion, and many other similar discussions have implicitly assumed that a reasonable income and living standard for 'them', is vastly different from ours, anchored in our privilege. Two peoples, two worlds.
That is the issue to face. Squarely.
Our double standards.

Sameer Shisodia This is so common and completely not thought about. 2L/month for "us" is "just about ok". But someone making 25000 amongst "them" is "not too bad". Because of what we've classified as "knowledge" work. As if a farmer needs to apply no knowledge. And a master lathesman has no skill. "The market" is an argument, yes, but goes to far. The role pricing power closer to the sources of money plays is ignored. 

We are all complicit.)


he auto driver yesterday, "Whats the Ola amount in your phone ? ... Just give me that as is. Is it Ok madam ? I will turn off the phone app."
"Sure. but why ?"
"Ola will take 30/- out of that amount straight. Each time it happens ... somedays I end up with a negative balance when I have no rides, and still have to pay.
... (some family stories. His wife, children ... how his home and stand is in Thoraipakkam. Full of IT companies, and how the employees will not walk to the auto stand. Will only want to be picked up at the door.)
Yes, about Ola madam. The Auto is ours, the phone is ours, the work and risks are ours. All that is theirs (Ola s) is a GPS app they download for us.
And do you know how much they make ? Yesterday I had some eight rides. Assume I gave 30/- per ride. ...
And all of us autos giving them that money. ... out of our earnings. "
I though of myself, of my training as a computer engineer. Fit to only support and sustain such strategies. Like Ola versus auto drivers. On the side of Ola. Always.
Umesh Pilania, Pavan Manikanta Kumar and 22 others
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  • Rajeev R. Singh In the rare eventuality that I need to take an auto, I walk to the stand and face a bunch of auto drivers. They stand there and don't wish to go. They wish to go anywhere other than where I might want them to go. Then I fight with them that it's precisely this attitude that made Olas and Ubers come and establish shop and then thrive. I tell them that I want the drivers to succeed not the Olas and Ubers. Rarely one or so driver might listen to me ....
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  • Aparna Krishnan My experience is that
    1. The poor have their story, and their reasons. And they are usually very reasonable ones. To understand one needs to immerse. In their lives.

    2. The poor are responsible, and work hard to sustain their families through honest means.

    It took many years of living with them in the same street to come to this firm understanding.
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    • Venkat Krishnan N Much though I believe that most of us are simply fortunate, I don't agree that the poor always have valid reasons. They operate pretty much like the rest of us- opportunistic when the occasion arises, pliant when they are without choice. 

      Rajeev's poi      nt above is really valid. Autos in Chennai used to ask for Rs100 for 4-5 km distances routinely, because people had no other option. On average, an Ola auto driver makes MORE money than a regular stand guy because their algorithms drive efficiency.

      In Mumbai, though, autowalas make a lot of money (20+K per month at least) because they largely ply by meter.

      I think it is important to differentiate "right and wrong" instead of making everything "us v/s them".
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    • Aparna Krishnan My point is that when the autos refuse to go, it is not laziness. (Though I am not sure that it is such a bad thing, laziness !). They wish to earn and sustain their families, just as we wish to. If they refuse there is usually a valid reason.
    • Aparna Krishnan As for auto driver making money, at days end they are still going to be poor and we are still going to stay privileged. 

      We (yes, we, as in we versus them) decide what is 'too much'.
      1
    • L Suresh Kumar Lsk Aparna Krishnan 

      Many times the auto drivers refuse to go where the customer needs to go. They either ask way too much (true for more than a decade) or they just refuse for some flimsy reason (eg no return ride). They can always get a return ride if they ask a nominal fare. They neither demand a nominal fare nor go by x kms @ y inr/km.
    • Aparna Krishnan Do you think they dont want to sustain their families, educate their children well ? Just as we seek to.
    • L Suresh Kumar Lsk That doesn't mean they can fleece the riders.
    • Aparna Krishnan I see. Please look closely at their lives, and that of their riders.

      And try to see who is fleecing whom.
    • Venkat Krishnan N We can either be mutually co-operative or exploitative. Auto meter fares at least in Tier 1 cities are well calibrated to help an auto driver make 20-25K a month IF they drive for at least 8-10 hours a day (which is not TOO much to ask for). A sincere auto driver pushing himself hard CAN earn more than that, save up to buy the auto (thus saving on daily rentals) and gradually go up to 30-50K a month. There are a few enterprising autowalas in Mumbai who make 75k+ per month. At 30+K a month, one can sustain families and probably 1 child (though I wonder why ANYONE including a billionaire shd have a child in this world instead of adopting).

      In this situation, unfortunately our autowalas in Chennai, Bangalore and earlier Delhi (now much better), played a "lose lose game". Both sides unfortunately lost in the process- passengers took expensive alternate options and drivers made less. 

      Ola has actually HELPED both sides (mainly thanks to the money poured in by US pensioners through various VC funds).

      I don't know much about the rural economy, but get to see the urban one from very close quarters. Today, a dependable maid makes MUCH more money than an unreliable graduate or sometimes even a post-graduate. Plumbers and electricians earn 30-40K+ per month very often (but not always).

      I think if we can focus on and build more mutually co-operative strategies, where we REJOICE in everyone making more money and doing well and being able to sustain, we will be happier. If we keep making it an "us v/s them" all the time, we will only divide people further and make them see each other's perspectives less and less...
      4
    • Prasanna Gandhi How do you conclude that autos are used by rich
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    • Prasanna Gandhi Or rather privileged
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    • Prasanna Gandhi Usually autos don't charge less if you are poor...
      1
    • Aparna Krishnan Venkat Krishnan N, I see the gap between the poor and rich widening. That make the 'them' versus 'us' too real to be ignored. Yes, of course we need win-win solutions. But that means that the rich need to get poorer, and the poor richer. In real ways.

      As for why they reproduce instead of adopting, I think they think theirs is the prettiest nose on earth, and for the good of the earth they want to pertetuate that. I for one see no other reason !
      1
    • Aparna Krishnan Prasanna Gandhi, generally speaking. Even i use the bus as far as possible. Definitely holds for the poor.
      1
    • Venkat Krishnan N That the rich need to get poorer and the poor richer I agree 100% with you on. I am not one of those "trickle down economists" who believe that the only way to lift everyone up is for the rich to make disproportionately more. We also need to weed out the MASSIVE corruption of the rich in India (just look at all the bank scams unfolding, the rich have been bigger beneficiaries of loan waivers than the poor in India).

      Poor earth- having to sustain far too many noses than it can :-(.
      2
    • Venkat Krishnan N Prasanna Gandhi for the purposes of these discussions, we must remember that anyone earning >35-40K a month is "rich" in India. bulk of the people who can afford autos are now in that segment. We are all rich (even you inspite of your amazingly simple lifestyle that I am always wowed by). Some of us are obscenely filthy rich.
    • Prasanna Gandhi People prefer ola not just because it is cheaper, it is because there a certain equity...The problem I had with the autos, were bargain, if you are a good bargainer, and informed you can get a lesser price if you are weak then you pay heavy....Let me who is usually weak poor or the privileged...Ola or metre gives me the confidence that i am not cheated...This is not to say it is cheaper...You feel cheated if someone pays less for the same service...That is exp most of us hate....People actually paying mor...
      2
    • Venkat Krishnan N Restricting only to the URBAN poor, if I applied Gandhiji's talisman, I would support Ola/Uber (not blindly, but in general). They have helped BOTH the commuters AND the drivers.
      Image may contain: text
    • Aparna Krishnan Prasanna Gandhi, Whos cheating whom ?? Please, please look at the lives of the auto driver and of the customer.

      I request you to take a step back and see the picture in entirity.
    • Prasanna Gandhi Pl read.fully...
    • Aparna Krishnan Venkat Krishnan N the talisman is pure genius. The simplicity hides the profoundity, and how it hits the heart of the matter. It has been a pillar of support down the years.
    • Venkat Krishnan N This is the problem, Prasanna & Aparna. We are not realising that both sides wind up cheating THEMSELVES in this process of counter accusations :-(.
      1
    • Venkat Krishnan N Aparna Krishnan so true... has been a core value for me for a long time, though I struggle A LOT to practise it.
    • Aparna Krishnan Venkat Krishnan N oh, I am far far away from it. but its been a pole star down the years.
    • L Suresh Kumar Lsk If only the auto drivers ply as per meter fare, they can earn well. They either fleece the customers or just sit idle in stands or simply refuse to come.

      Ola and Uber have changed the attitude of such drivers.
    • L Suresh Kumar Lsk Even in Coimbatore, makkal.auto and namma.auto provide hassle free rides.
      1
    • Prasanna Gandhi So I don't bargain...I usually give...it too much of thinking for me... most of times I know I pay more from the same service than some other...it is not the price... you feel like a fool when you pay 500 rs for 3 km ride...so if I have to take a bigger picture of life and think he is poor it is right for him, 
      and the situation, and go on guilt ride then it never ends...where do you draw a line..
      2
    • Rani Sasikumar I agree to venkats view
    • Venkat Krishnan N L Suresh Kumar Lsk unfortunately this is human nature combined with a bit of poor sensitivity. We commuters are equally guilty of it. Everyone seems to be operating from the "my interest alone" space. For example, we fix fares per km by meter, ASSUMING there will be equal traffic in both directions. Then we expect the autowalas to go in the peak direction at "meter fare" and return at "nominal fare". Which is not fair ;-)! Ola and Uber algorithms price these in well. For example, in Mumbai, you will pay say, Rs180 from Andheri to Lower Parel at 7:30am but Rs330 at 9am. And probably Rs160 from Lower Parel to Andheri at 830am or so (haven't tried that reverse journey, so not sure).

      We are failing because we are not learning to LISTEN to the others with the goal of finding win win solutions.
      •  
    • L Suresh Kumar Lsk Venkat Krishnan N 

      I've come across many good Auto drivers. Such people are polite, courteous, ask nominal fare, drive carefully over speed bumps and end up getting tips of 20-30 inr even during less traffic.
      2
    • Aparna Krishnan My point is different. After all this juggling the poor stay poor, and our privilge stays safe. 
      Anyway waiting for far bigger sweeping changes. One day.
      Till then, some patchwork intervertions.
      2
    • Venkat Krishnan N Things will unfortunately get only worse (inequality wise) as long as we have capitalism as the fundamental premise backed with "excess centralised government" and with the onslaught of AI.
    • Prasanna Gandhi Consumerism rather
      •  
  • L Suresh Kumar Lsk Ola auto fares seem higher than Uber auto fares in Chennai. But they are better than taking an auto from a stand or one on the way.
  • Auto driver beaten to death ‘for taking correct fare’ in Karnataka
    THEHINDU.COM
    Auto driver beaten to death ‘for taking correct fare’ in Karnataka
    Auto driver beaten to death ‘for taking correct fare’ in Karnataka
  • Aparna Krishnan Please compare the lives of the auto drivers. With our privilege. And then see who is expoliting whom.
    1
    • Sridhar Pabbisetty Aparna Krishnan looks like this driver lost his life in vain. Maybe someday we will understand lives of such people better.
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