Tuesday 31 December 2019

Every Woman faces harrasment, that the men dont see.

Aparna Krishnan
Yesterday at 11:31 AM

Panchali Shabadham, Draupadi's vastraharanam, enacted at Kalakshetra was searing. As it always is. Enacted in the village. Or in the city.
However nothing has really changed down millenia. Through my growing years, when there were different levels of harassment in buses by men, the surrounding men were identical to those in the Kuru court. Dhritharashtra, Bheeshma, Dronacharya, Kripacharya.
Acting blind, or watching indifferently. Or wringing hands helplessly. Maybe afraid to take a stance, maybe coolly indifferent.
Every woman in this land would testify to this reality. It's the same old story. Always. In different settings.
Old wine in new bottles.

...

Aparna Krishnan
Yesterday at 3:14 PM
This is a question to the men in my friends list.
When girls are being harassed in buses or streets why do men mostly not intervene.
Is it fear ? Or indifference ? Or something else ? 

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  • Jaes Jay Wiki Fear and Indifference. Takes time to intervene in n considering it as a public issue.
    • Aparna Krishnan Jaes Jay Wiki blood doesn't boil ? My blood boils when I see young girls squirm in buses, with men pushing themselves on them when they can easily stand on another side. I am usually the only one calling them out.

      It is not even fear, those perverts are cowards can't go anything in a crowded bus.

      Fear comes after wanting to intervene. I doubt if the men watching even want to.
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    • Jaes Jay Wiki Not at all. It depends on what kind of ppl we r surround with. Nt all men. Long ago my bro kicked out a guy from a bus as he tried to harass a gal. No one supported. Ppl in d bus has no clue. One or two around him only knws but calm. Others be like 'ennanu therila' and 'namakken indha prechchanai'. But if someone get caught they'll beat black n blue...
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  • Bhaskar Prabhu no empathy-no ability to understand
    Write a reply...

  • T.R. Shashwath Fear, and "mind your own business"...
  • Sri N Srivatsa No AK. Not all men. Some of us do intervene but that's not much unfortunately.
  • Ravi Shankarnarayana indifference..... the same guys would intervene if the concerned girls were family or close friends.....
    • Aparna Krishnan Ravi Shankarnarayana very soon there also they will stop ... Indifference and cowardice has a way of growing. Just as courage has a way of growing.

      Everything needs exercise. Bravery, empathy included.
      1
  • Deepa Nair Fear
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  • Krishna Telikepalli Honestly, I have not come across such a situation in my life so far!
    • Aparna Krishnan Krishna Telikepalli that is male privilege.

      Every woman in this land has faced this, and lives in this unsaid fear. Positioning oneself in buses safely becomes an unfortunate habit.
      1
  • Sampatt Shetty Why should I get into.....
  • S R Suryanarayanan I have never seen anyone harassing women..either in bus or train...i have no idea how it's done until i came across such incidents in media or news papers..
    • Aparna Krishnan S R Suryanarayanan it's all too common. I think men simply are not affected and do not see. It's like those if us who are upper caste and upper class fail to see many inequities.
    • S R Suryanarayanan Aparna Krishnan ji i was actually honest in my comment..had i seen some injustice or had some women brought this to my notice i would have surely raised a voice..i don't know even one person who have complained about such incidents....
      See India is huge population..even if a few 100 incidents occur, in percentage terms it's is miniscule and rare..and everyone doesn't come across them..we only know through media.
    • Aparna Krishnan I know you meant it. But we women see it everywhere. Our antennae are up. Men in the privilege of their gender do not face it and so do not see it.

      Let me make a post asking for women who have not faced physical harassment. In buses, public spaces, anywhere. Lets see if there is one.
    • Aparna Krishnan Posted.
      1
    Write a reply...

  • Shobhit Tiwari I've never came across any such situation so far, but i know Very well, if i do see such act happening in front of my eyes, i will definitely intervene....
    • Aparna Krishnan Shobhit Tiwari it happens everywhere. Publuc buses, especially in the North. Delhi is worst. I think men stay unaware. As they don't face it.
  • Aparna Krishnan Please see my next post to women.
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  • Chidambaran Subramanian When I grew and where I grew up (Bombay/Mumbai) public harrassment of women wasn't really commonplace. Growing up I was fairly close to my mother. Going in trains was fairly commonplace and unless it was crowded, I dont remember my mother having any issues with going in general compartments , or even other female relatives doing the same.
    I was in Mumbai till I was 17 (class 12) and don't recall any conversation where anyone (male or female) was talking about violating anybody's bodily integrity publicly. Of course massive crowds in Dadar, was always common.
    Again I am commenting based on what I know.
    Fast forward to IIT Kgp where there were kids from all over India, that was the first time I heard other guys tallking about touching / women etc. And of course using colourful lingo -- stuff that you would never hear in Mumbai.

    I had to make a 2 day trip to Delhi , where I saw something that was truly shocking. I was in a bus, where I saw one guy putting his leg on top of a seat where two girls were sitting. I made half a move to say something but decided discretion was the better part of valour ( rest of the bus ignored it)
  • Aparna Krishnan Many times discretion is not the better part of valor ... Yes, Bombay is better I have heard.

    But it is clear that men, secure themselves, fail to see many details. Thst blindness happens in every equation of privilege, and lack of it.
    • Chidambaran Subramanian I was in an alien city. Would have reacted very differently if I was in Mumbai -- for that matter would never have seen something like that in mumbai. have seen a woman cornering a guy when he touched her on her breasts. The guy was completely frozen. all passersby would side typically with the woman
    • Chidambaran Subramanian Delhi the (mis)behaviour was in the open, I was quite shaken.
    Write a reply...

  • Raj Jog Singh Is it really true that men do not. On the contrary my opinion is that they many times go overboard with the notion of chivalry and the same is often misused by scrupulous females. We have shades on both sides of the gender divide. Yes a larger issue of losing empathy is common place to society irrespecive of Gender. Be it accidents or any other first movers are rare. Though once somebody moves others will pitch in.
    1
  • Aparna Krishnan No, nobody goes overboard. Or anywhere away from their seats. Don't you worry.

    When men harass, others look away.

    Yes, in the village, which is a community, the harassaer will be beaten up. That is where I gave felt really secure.
    1


...

This is a question to women in my friends list.
Is there anyone who has never faced physical harassment of one kind or another in buses, public spaces.
My schooling was in Delhi. As a schoolgirl walking down roads, I have had men on cycles slow down to grope. I have seen friends face it. Through college days, in DTC buses, i used to have to place my bag so that the man behind could not 'keeping falling on me'. I always had a pin on me. One lived life on the alert mode. There was no other way.
I though the south was a better place. In a sense it is. But I hear similar stories here also. The other day in the bus a man was 'falling' over a college girl despite all her protests. Alll men watched on in stony silence. I had to shout at this man who thern moved a few milimeters away.
I am making this post because in response to my last post I see that many men are unaware of this reality. And think that maybe a few odd cases are drummed up by women.
I request women who have never faced such sexual harassment to say so and we can count and see.
Krishna Telikepalli, Sumati Ram-Mohan and 18 others
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  • Radhika Ganganna If almost all women have undergone this, one or the other time in their life, is it possible that men are not aware of it!
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  • Nikhil Seri I heard my mom describe the horrific incident where a man spit out paan on her white dress. I heard a friend describe being almost kidnapped by an auto driver who wouldn't stop when asked to. She had to jump out while the vehicle was in motion and the man drove away without even stopping. As a kid I saw my own auto driver hitting women from behind while driving past them. We are all aware, we are just shamelessly silent.
    2
  • Ranika Kararia Since forever!! Delhi has the worst crowd. Grew up here too, spent some years in school and college. I almost got shoved into a car by 2 boys.
    I totally agree with you, men who even understand and are aware of the extent of harassment, can never reall    y gauge the mental trauma a woman suffers. It's a scar for life. I can never feel safe in Delhi, especially. Ready to kill to defend myself if the need arises...no qualms about it.
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  • Sai Padma i have faced physical harassament in most odd places. hospitals, diagnostic labs, as a disabled sometimes people lifting bodily etc. I used to keep mum. but feeling very lost irritated etc.. one day my grandmother said.. you dont have legs or body functioning.. dont you have voice.. ? seriously from then, i never kept quite. i slapped senior male student who is talking ill and try to dash me when i am struggling with my calipers. since then, schools and colleges were never a problem. but hospitals and diagnostic labs and especially orthotists who drink too much.. and caliper makers.. most unexpected places where you feel most vulnerable and helpless. still i cant go to a diagnostic lab alone and feel comfortable.
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    • Aparna Krishnan Sai Padma yes, I understand. And tho it's unbelievable they behave that way. Yes.
    • Sai Padma sometimes no body believed. as doctor/helath professional is healer and solution maker etc. i shudder sometimes, being daughter of two doctors, i faced this.. what about other girls
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    • Ranika Kararia Society is beyond repair. So sorry to hear of this. It's shocking.
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  • Malavika Sidhanti Assuming it's much safer here in Bengaluru...or I've been fortunate?
    Write a reply...

  • Durga Movva I have faced bullying and eveteasing through school and college and reached a point where I started questioning myself if something is wrong with me ....happens everywhere with every woman ...workplaces with the so called educated/ literate ppl are no exception....was troubled by a pervert superior with cheap comments...many times when a woman reports such things she needs to prove it...how can such things be proven .....
    • Aparna Krishnan Durga Movva yes. Everywhere. And it's surprising that the other half dont realise its pervasiveness.
    • Durga Movva And unfortunately in the world that we are living in ...most of the times the women are only blamed for either travelling alone or the way they are dressed ..many many reasons well known to them ..according to them it's always the fault of a woman to get into such situations ....like we are dying and waiting for all this to happen!
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  • Kavitha Nistala Gollapudi Aparna Garu happens at all stages. One of my cousins on the pretext of teaching a 2 wheeler used to hug, sit so close that it was disgusting. He would wrap his hands around my chest and I literally used to tell him to sit far away. When he didn't change his ways- I went ahead to complain to my grandparents- that was the end of his teaching. I learnt the vehicle on my own. After our 10th we went in to collect our transfer certificates from our school secretary- one of my friends had a mole on her thigh and this guy says - you are going to show me where it is on your thigh. My friend was scared but since we were a group, he was quiet. I did shout at him after receiving the required certificates. But the point is it's at every level. You previous was valid - men play a blind eye to it. These are just a few. Many incidents happen when you get on the crowded buses. There are incidents where my friends slapped the guy because he was so close as if he was going to do it. She literally slapped him.
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    • Aparna Krishnan Kavitha Nistala Gollapudi it's sick. We grow up dealing with this thro life. And it's half the population that is facing this. The other half is well, the Kuru elders while Draupadi was disrobed.
  • Veena Maruthoor Of course we face same and more in Kerala too
  • Pushpa Upadhyay Like you said...I am always on alert mode and most women I have come across have shared the same stress of being on the toes...always
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  • Nikhini Varma Bodakunta I guess no such women exists!!
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  • Ananthi Krishnasamy Not one single women I guess...my grandmom had a story to say,mum had some and I have plenty....even till date certain buses gives me a nightmare...
    And men claiming no such thing exists plz do ask them the direction for that lala land...atleast let my daughter not have a story to say
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  • Rajeshwari Ganesan I have faced groping, lewd words, and more on multiple instances in Trichy, Trivandrum, Delhi, Chennai from before I turned 13. Somehow, it is difficult to believe men are unaware of this, given how widespread the occurrence is. Also, men cite these issues when they want to curb girls and women for their protection
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  • Yulaume Thangaraj V Naiud They are unaware because they consider it normalcy.
  • RJ Sudha Growing up in Chennai (Madras), it was confined to eve-teasing and the likes that I was very skilled to give back. But not to the extent of what is being described here.
    Write a reply...

  • Prashanthi Atluri So many stories

    Some how I don’t see it in the US. May be I am wrong .. but it is not as bad as in India.
    I am used to going to work atodd hours sometimes mid nights when I have a case .. I still walk all by myself from the parking lot to the OR. May be we have CC camera all over?

    Even my husband never described these accidents at his place of work - Emergency room. Yes we do have rape victims and doemstic violence issues but not groping or Eve teasing to this extent.

    Have been working in ECHO lab for more than 10 yrs .. pts undress and dress - all this time my technicians wait out side patiently and they describe to the patient what they are about to do and only after getting pt’s permission they lift up their gown and proceed to examine. Never have I heard of any misbehavior or disrespect to men or women.
    • Kavitha Nistala Gollapudi Prashanthi Atluri in western countries it’s diff. Peado’s exist and he could’ve your neighbor but you are not aware. Child grooming online in chat rooms posing as adults is existent. Same thing different ways.
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    • Prashanthi Atluri Very likely I agree with you. Since Aparna was asking personal experiences I wrote this down. I have two daughters. I don’t want this to happen to any child boy or girl! And I don’t want any girl to write what we are writing here today in future.

      What a world we live in! We have normalized everything !
    • Arindam Ghosh My wife breathed a sigh of relief about this when she arrived in USA. That's how I came to know about the reality. Yes US has other problems. Once I mentioned this in our college whatsapp group and reaction was on the same expected line saying that USA is no better and a general disbelief that all women are subjected to this.
    • Aparna Krishnan Kavitha Nistala Gollapudi yes, it happens in more polished forms, less visible.



...

I have a third and last question. Again to the women in my timeline this time.
Why don't women raise their voice and fists when they see other women being harassed by men.
In public buses when I have been harassed, when I have seen other women harassed, often there would be no other women adding to my voice when I shouted at the perpetrator. Even just demanding he stand away, maintain a distance.
Sometimes one other woman maybe. Usually elderly.
Why ?
Indifference ?
But we feel and share the pain, the sense of vulnerability, the rage, the shame. The fear. There cannot be lack of empathy. Tomorrow we or our daughters will face this, we know.
Fear ?
Not in calling out in public, crowded places ! In bylanes maybe.
Embarrassment at talking in public ?
I don't think so. Women in buses have usually outgrown the ghoonghat long back
It's fine to question the men on their stubborn silences. Like Draupadi questioned the Kuru elders. But our own silences ?
Sumanas Koulagi, Nrithya Pillai and 12 others
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  • Lakshmi Rekha I have wondered on these same points!! According to me its apathy and/or embarrassment!!
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  • Lakshmi Rekha Not just this issue, on any issue of social relevance, whether among friends or family, I find myself a lone stander vouching for the cause!
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  • Reena Sujai Again tagging my bestie Namrata Patel who has stood up for me not once but on several occasions. I remember this particular incident where after a good thrashing she made the fellow get out of the bus 😊.
  • Rajeshwari Ganesan Fighting all the time is emotionally draining. By the time a woman makes it to the bus, she has already made it through the obstacle race of family expectations and demands and is trying to regroup for the next set of expectations in office, or the other way around
    • Aparna Krishnan Rajeshwari Ganesan true. Still watching other women face harassment ... And look out of the window ???
    • Rajeshwari Ganesan Aparna Krishnan if you are already drained then you become apathetic. Many women are fighting a lone battle, facing "if you want to work outside the house you need to complete all these chores before you leave." They are constantly judged, "oh, she speaks up because she is earning, or educated, or pretty, or her husband is rich, or something else." Very rarely do we say "her point is valid" or "maybe she has missed a nuance, but there is some truth in what she says". This doesn't happen when a boy or man speaks up. This constant dismissal is what silences women in public, when men are around. The constant dripping of criticism that erodes her confidence to speak up
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    • Rajeshwari Ganesan I was recently told that I don't know how men think of women and girls, when I have experienced their thoughts and actions since I was 10 years old.
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    • Aparna Krishnan Rajeshwari Ganesan yes true. It's draining at every level. Men, the best if then, refuse to face their privilege, leave alone give them up. So when a woman asserts herself it's seen as declaration if war. On every front.

      And yet, I think speaking up for another is a requirement that cannot be jettisoned. Despite all ones burdens.
    • Rajeshwari Ganesan Aparna Krishnan I guess I am forgiving of women who don't speak up, because I feel they are already overwhelmed. Those who are able to, do speak up. But judging those women who do not only adds to their burdens. Even women who appear to be privileged are usually burdened, but perhaps unable to voice their complaints because of their circumstances
    • Aparna Krishnan Rajeshwari Ganesan each of us has a duty to those in greater distress.

      I have seen battered women stand up for other women.

      Having said that. Yes, a woman can have vast burdens ... carried in silence.
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  • Ranika Kararia Indifference, maybe. Not come across too many such situations seeing other women being harassed. On some occasions I have seen cars slow down or stop towards girls walking alone. A couple of times I charged mine at them honking to scare them away, it works.

    Men usually sneakily perform their acts in moving crowds and move away too fast for anyone to judge who it was, or in isolation. Many times girls are caught unawares themselves to react promptly.

    Families too ingrain in the female mind to ignore and move on. That attitude remains. Nobody wants to waste their time. I've noticed, college girls and elderly ladies speak up more . It's the women in-between who will walk away. Maybe with a young kid in tow whom they want to 'protect' from being witness to eveteasing, or rushing for whatever they think is more worth their time.

    And as someone said, probably emotionally draining and so they choose not to react for others.

    Also...I was surprised to know recently that we still have women folk who believe some women "ask" for it by the way they dress or behave. I don't expect such women to speak up for another woman.
  • Aparna Krishnan Yes, its many layers of conditioning and many levels of erosion of confidence.

    Each needs to be tabled and faced before we can begin to move on.
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    • Ranika Kararia Glad you posted this series. People need to wake up
    • Aparna Krishnan Ranika Kararia this is in all our minds all the time. Conscious, sub conscious ...

      The other day when I saw the Draupadi vastraharanam, and the men, giants if men like Bheeshma, mutely watch, I realised how it was not very different today either.
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  • Mamatha Rai In few occasions I did shout at perpetrators when girls stood helpless and quite in a bus.
    • Aparna Krishnan Mamatha Rai yes they stand so helplessly. Conditioned into silence.

      When I was in college, for me also it was an effort to speak up. All eyes would turn on me. To watch. Not to support.

      It's hard.
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  • Sivapriya Krishnan I have whenever i have encountered similar situations in pubkic spaces. But if its domestic find it very difficult esp. With my maids. Because the women ate willing to put up with nonsense guving their own logic to it.!
    1
  • Anjana Unnikrishnan There should be a conditioning where it would be ok for women to speak out. We don't allow it enough in our family spaces. There's a tendency to make fun of what women have to say, to bully them into keeping quiet and to shush them saying they are exceeding the boundaries. Only when empathy and confidence are both ingrained can women be expected to speak out.

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