Saturday, 28 January 2017

FB Discussions - Irrelevence of Atheistic Left

 (via Sunny Narang)
India has more than 4500 jatis and tribes and that is its deepest plurality that will never allow an universal single truth to rule.

All these intellectuals and activists are a small subjati of modernists. They are hated by globalist capitalists and liberal nationalists.

Leftists have died everywhere. Left by insisting on a western radical universalism is against the soul of left which is Basvanna Kabir Nanak.

Look at any social agent in Indic history there always is a spiritual movement associated.
Left has no soul no rasa no understanding of jati.

India did not have a "revolution" ever in its history as we are so plural.

That is what they hate as they cannot fit India in their 4-5 categories of hate.

Raghurama Rao Suswaram That seems an acceptable analysis. One important point is worth stating here. The strong concern left has for the poor and the lower sections of the society is largely missing in the right wing and the status-quo-ists. Isn't it tremendously important?

Sunny Narang Did'nt Gandhi , Vinobha Bhave , and many many more have a concern for the poor ? The left only knows one language of perpetual class war as the foundation of history . And just like Jihadis will never have a Caliphate the left will never have its Utopia , so both will be always in a state of violence . Then poor don't matter , only victories do .
Aparna Krishnan I wonder how it got publically 'understood' that the left is 'more concerned' than anyone else. Kabir, Guru Nanak included !
Sunny Narang Just like businesses want a monopoly or a duopoly to gather the market same happens with ideologues of social-theory , the left want's a monopoly on poor ;-)
शशि शर्मा India needs another Gandhi.
Palanivelu Rangasamy A Gandhi emerges out of innumerable individual transformations in that direction.
Raghurama Rao Suswaram Gandhi and Buddha are yuga-purushas. World will rarely see such great souls.
Mohammad Chappalwala Sunny makes a lot of sense most of the times but he needs to read more on left
Sunny Narang Mohammad I have read and known enough leftists for many lifetimes , from all varieties Gramscian to Stalinists , CPI(ML) Liberation to Trotskyists .
Sunny Narang And maybe you need to read a lot more on what has been Indic systems of social transformation and change since 5000 years .
Sunny Narang And how republicanism and monarchy has always been in battle in India "To return to the Indian gana-sangha, the chief, also called ganapati or sanghamukhya, and the council or sabha met in the assembly hall called the santhagara. The office of the chief was not hereditary and he was elected for life. Meetings at the santhagara were probably announced by the beating of drums and there was a regulator of seats. Voting was done using pieces of wood called salakas and the collector of these votes was called the salaka-gahapati chosen for his honesty and impartiality. The gana puraka ensured the necessary quorum. Important matters were debated and decided by voting or by a consensus. There were advisers to the chief for administrative, treasury and military matters. Division of assemblies into political parties was well known as well as a division into smaller committees for specific purposes.

It has been mentioned that the battle between monarchy and republicanism was fought in the Indian sub-continent between Magadha and Vaishali. Much has been said about Magadha in earlier columns and it is worth looking at the Vajji Federation, made up of a number of gana-sanghas, which had its capital in Vaishali, in greater detail. This will be with specific reference to the Lichchavis, the most powerful and important constituents of this federation.

The Lichchavis formed a gana-sangha, where a considerable portion of the population was vested with the final power and ultimate authority of the state. They assembled at their capital, Vaishali, and had a council of nine nobles that was responsible to the assembly. All the members of the assembly were designated as rajas thus explaining the famous preamble to the Ekpanna-Jataka, which refers to 7707 rajas, uprajas, senapatis and bhandagarikas of Vaishali. The santhagara, where they met, was a political, religious and social centre, where decisions were taken using a political procedure similar to that described above."\

Political participation of women seems to have been far greater in the ancient Indian proto-republics…
Sunny Narang 12 th century Basavanna 'The path given by Basavanna revolutionized the very idea of who and how people can enjoy the divine bliss. Shunning gender, age, caste, religion, and status based discrimination, Basavanna enabled all sincere aspirants to tread this path and reach great spiritual heights. Rather than confining the individual inner experience with the framework of scriptures, this path emphasized genuine experience tempered with true knowledge and right conduct. Individuals were able to cut the shackles of religion and rise to spiritual heights.

Socially, this revolution shattered the shackles of tradition binding people to the prevalent social practices of discrimination and abuse. It liberated many suppressed and downtrodden aspirants and presented them with an opportunity to lead a life of dignity. It fought against the rampant oppression exciting in the society resulting from caste and gender biases. It introduced an entire new lifestyle that brought equality, hope, and prosperity to one and all. Basavanna’s revolution empowered common folks in an unprecedented manner giving them choice in their spiritual pursuits as well as social living. "

Basava Divine Center, Dedicated to spreading the message and spiritual practices of Guru Basavanna
Sunny Narang Written in 1990 in the backdrop of mandir-mandal conflict, the drama draws parallel between the Socio-Religious Political and Economic condition of existing times and southern India in the 12th century A.D. during Bhakti Movement. Eight hundred years ago in the city of Kalyan a man called Basavanna assembled a congregation of poets, mystics, social revolutionaries and philosophers, unmatched for their creativity and social commitment in the history of Karnataka, even perhaps of India itself.

They opposed idolatry, rejected temple worship, upheld equality of sexes, and condemned the caste system .But event took a violent turn when they acted on their beliefs and a Brahmin girl married a 'low caste' boy.The movement ended in bloodshed .Rakt Kalyan (Tale-Danda) deals with few weeks during which a vibrant, prosperous society plunged into anarchy and terror.

Taledanda (Kannada: ತಲೆದಂಡ, Hindi: Rakt Kalyan, literally: Death by Beheading) is a 1990 Kannada play written by Girish Karnad, an eminent person in Kannada literature, about the rise of the radical protest and reform movement, Veerashaivism, in 12th century Karnataka. He was awarded the Karnataka S...
Sunny Narang Gandhi met Narayana Guru at Sivagiri in 1925. While Gandhiji tried to abolish untouchability from within the varna system, Narayana Guru condemned chaturvarnya as against the advaita spirit. The meeting with Narayana Guru triggered a crucial transformation in Gandhiji’s approach to caste conflict.
Guru organized the first-ever All Religions Conference in Asia and only the second in the world, in Alwaye in 1924 with the message: “We meet here to know and let know, not to argue and win.”
We are One
Narayana Guru transformed people through compassion and a disarming sense of humor. Writes Nataraja Guru, “Manifold were the ways in which he became intimately related to the people. He was thus loved and respected as a leader within a growing circle of devotees. To come into touch with him was to be influenced by him for life.”
Brahmins challenged his Sivalinga consecration at Aruvippuram, he silenced them with this statement, “I was not installing a Brahmin’s Siva, only our Siva.” Once when the guru was traveling by train, a passenger asked his caste. The guru replied that his caste was humanity.

Aparna Krishnan Yes, these are the processes that can take root in this land. And have taken root ever and anon.
Sunny Narang Never atheism of any kind and irreconcilable class or caste enmity has ever worked on this land . Left is out of its depth completely on this land and has never got a following except in few states for some moment in time, if any ideology is fully irrelevant in India it is the atheistic left.
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  Why "atheistic socialism" of Nehru will not just never be accepted by Indian Muslims as Iqbal writes to Jinnah clearly in his letters in 1937 , it will also never be accepted by any believer in Sanatan Dharmic or believer Hindus in India , or Sikhs or any of the multiple god-loving communities in India .
The state that has been created in India after 1947 , needs a deep decentralized community and culture driven renaissance that derives its genius from the multiple plurality of Indic faiths , beliefs and knowledge systems .
M.K.Gandhi , Maulana Azad were both believers and were the peace-makers , not the atheists like Nehru and Jinnah whose interest was only political power .
Atheism is at best a tiny narrative , on the sidelines , among the hundreds of other faith , belief and cultural systems of India , nothing more .
India or any part of the Indian subcontinent can never be run by atheists or those who have no sense of the divine . Whether it is Buddhist Bhutan or Buddhist-Hindu Sri Lanka or Hindu-Muslim-Sikh-Isai-A thousand tribal faith India , or Muslim Pakistan and Bangladesh or Hindu Nepal .
Jinnah issued the following condolence message on the death of Allama Iqbal:
“To me he was a friend, guide and philosopher and during the darkest moments through which the Muslim League had to go, he stood like a rock and never flinched one single moment and as a result just only three days ago he must have read of been informed of the complete unity that was achieved in Calcutta of the Muslim leaders of the Punjab and today I can say with pride that the Muslims of Punjab are wholeheartedly with the League and have come under the flag of the All-India Muslim League, which must have been a matter of greatest satisfaction to him.
In the achievement of this unity Sir Muhammad Iqbal played a most signal part.”
(Calcutta, April 21, 1938)
Quaid-e-Azam’s reported Speech at a public meeting to mourn the death of Allama Iqbal:
To me he was a personal friend, philosopher and guide and as such the main source of my inspiration and spiritual support”.
(Calcutta, April 21, 1938, The Star of India, April 22, 1938)
Letter sent by Jinnah on Iqbal Day, Hyderabad (Deccan), August 9, 1941.(Facsimile included in Discourses of Iqbal by Shahid Hussain Razzaqi (1979/2003), Iqbal Academy Pakistan, Lahore)
Iqbal was a poet who inspired Muslims with the spirit and determination to restore to Islam its former glory and although he is no more with us, his memory will grow younger and younger with the progress and development of Muslim India.
Message on Iqbal Day being celebrated at Lahore, New Delhi, December 8, 1944 (The Dawn, December 11, 1944)
Though he is not amongst us, his verse, immortal as it is, is always there to guide us and to inspire us. His poetry, besides being beautiful in form and sweet in language, presents to us a picture of the mind and heart of this great poet, and we find how deeply he was devoted to the teachings of Islam.
He was a true and faithful follower of the Holy Prophet (peace be upon him), a Muslim first and a Muslim last. He was the interpreter and voice of Islam.”…/what-iqbal-was-for-jin…/
Muhammad Ali Jinnah (Urdu: محمد علی جناح‎ ALA-LC: Muḥammad ʿAlī Jināḥ, born Mahomedali Jinnahbhai; 25 December 1876 – 11 September 1948)
Sir Muhammad Iqbal (Urdu: محمد اقبال ‎) (November 9, 1877 – April 21, 1938), widely known as Allama Iqbal (علامہ اقبال), was a poet, philosopher, and politician, as well as an academic, barrister and scholar in British India who is widely regarded as having inspired the Pakistan Movement. He is called the "Spiritual father of Pakistan".He is considered one of the most important figures in Urdu literature,with literary work in both the Urdu and Persian languages.
28th May, 1937
The atheistic socialism of Jawahar Lal [Nehru] is not likely to receive much response from the Muslims. The question therefore is: how is it possible to solve the problem of Muslim poverty? And the whole future of the League depends on the League's activity to solve this question. If the League can give no such promises I am sure the Muslim masses will remain indifferent to it as before.
But the enforcement and development of the Shariat of Islam is impossible in this country without a free Muslim state or states. This has been my honest conviction for many years and I still believe this to be the only way to solve the problem of bread for Muslims as well as to secure a peaceful India.
If such a thing is impossible in India the only other alternative is a civil war which as a matter of fact has been going on for some time in the shape of Hindu Muslim riots. I fear that in certain parts of the country, e.g. N.W. India, Palestine may be repeated..
Also the insertion of Jawarhar Lal's socialism into the body-politic of Hinduism is likely to cause much bloodshed among the Hindus themselves.
But it is clear to my mind that if Hinduism accepts social democracy it must necessarily cease to be Hinduism.
But as I have said above in order to make it possible for Muslim India to solve the problems it is necessary to redistribute the country and to provide one or more Muslim states with absolute majorities. Don't you think that the time for such a demand has already arrived? Perhaps this is the best reply you can give to the atheistic socialism of Jawahar Lal Nehru.
Anyhow I have given you my own thoughts in the hope that you will give them serious consideration either in your address or in the discussions of the coming session of the League. Muslim India hopes that at this serious juncture your genius will discover some way out of our present difficulties.
Yours Sincerely,
(Sd.) Mohammad. Iqbal

Aparna Krishnan It cannot take root, because people are religious. And contempt of the beleifs of people can never take anyone anywhere.

Sunny Narang Even in Latin America it was Christian priests who evolved Liberation theology .
Sunny Narang The Indian left has been the most irrelevant and copy-paste left in the world, no creativity or imagination rooting their left in Indic narratives. First Soviets then Maoists are their hegemonic leaders , there has never been an Indic left !
Sunny Narang That is why they have no presence in Pakistan or Bangladesh . Only where Chinese funding happens as in Nepal they are there .
Sunny Narang And in India the left was always funded by Soviets and China , and then the Soviets realised the inanity and stupidity of the Indian Left and paid the Congress directly "The Soviets supplied clandestine money to the Congress and individual politicians, with up to 40% of Indira Gandhi’s parliamentarians receiving political contributions from Moscow, a recently declassified CIA says, mirroring similar assertions in highly classified KGB records leaked in 2005.

The CIA’s assessment then was that the funding by the KGB gave ready access to many leaders and helped Moscow influence Indian policies. In the leaked KGB papers revealed by Mitrokhin too, India is described as a model of the KGBs infiltration in third world governments, with scores of sources across the government.

“As many as 40% Congress MPs in Mrs Gandhi’s last government had received Soviet political contributions,” the report titled “The Soviets in India” reads, adding that “the Soviet embassy maintains a large reserve of rupees for various uses — including clandestine payments to Congress politicians.”

Read more at:

The CIA documents accessed by ET allege Soviets provided kickbacks to the Congress party through arrangements with Indian businessmen.
Sunny Narang In 1962, as the Indian army fought Chinese aggression in the Himalayas, the undivided CPI supported China, putting ideology above nation. The government threw several communist leaders in prison. VS, then 39 and a central committee member, was put in Thiruvananthapuram central jail.

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